Without starting a ruckus

[DATsBBQ]

A lot of folks, myself included, don't quite get the differences between ICBS, LSBS, KCBS, MIM and the list goes on. So if someone who is a member of one or more of these groups could expound upon the virtues of their group(s) without disparging the remaining groups, I for one would be most grateful. How's that for a run-on sentence?

[Burnt Food Dude]

I can tell you that KCBS cooks have to cook 4 meats with, or without garnish. Chicken, pork ribs, pork shoulder and brisket. The should can be broken down into the butt or picnic. Minimum weight is 5 pounds. One blind judging with no comparing of entries. The total points of the 4 meats is crowned the Grand Champion.

As I was told by Mike Mills, MIM or the new MBN cooks pork ribs, the whole pork shoulder and a complete pig. There are 2 rounds of judging. Round one is a blind judging and comparisons to each entry made. The top 3 entries from each category are named. Round two is 3 judges come to the cooking area (at different times) to inspect, taste more of the entries and talk to the three top teams in each category. The top winner in each category is announced. The teams that scores the most individual points is declared winner. EX: If the team that had the best rib total beats the team with the best shoulder total and the whole hog total, it is declared the GC. The totals of each category are not added together.

Hope this helps.

[DATsBBQ]

BFD, do all the judges at a KCBS event have to be certified? Or are "celebrity" judges ok?

MIM = Memphis in May, what does MBN stand for?

[bigwheel]

IBCA and LSBS is usually 3 meats...split chickens..pork spare ribs..brisket and normally have Jackpot Beans..meaning it dont have much of nothing to do with the cookoff. Occasionally they will throw in pushed pork but not often. They also occasionally have other categories such as wild hawg..goats..sheeps. Pie..blood marys..margaritoes etc also set up on the separate Jackpot basis. All the table judging is strictly man/lady off the street. Though think they would let some of them yankee KCBS professional exspurt judges do some judging if there was any to be had.

bigwheel

[Lynn]

A lot of folks, myself included, don't quite get the differences between ICBS, LSBS, KCBS, MIM and the list goes on. So if someone who is a member of one or more of these groups could expound upon the virtues of their group(s) without disparging the remaining groups, I for one would be most grateful. How's that for a run-on sentence?

IBCA was started in to standardize the rules in the Texas area but we are spreading into other states. We use the double theater tickets on our turn-in boxes - one is taped to the top of the turn-in tray and the cook retains the other. NO ONE knows who the winning containers belong to until the tickets are matched. We also have the cook's sign the ticket that they retain so that there isn't any exchanging of tickets.

When the turn-in trays are issued the teams are give a piece of foil (potato wrap) to be laid flat in the tray - and are instructed to the exact amount of product to put into the trays plus the way it is placed in the tray.

1/2 chicken - fully jointed with a wing, breast, drumstick and thigh
7 - Pork SPARE Ribs individual with bone in placed horizonal with the hinge, meat side up all in the same direction. - NO BABY BACKS are allowed.
7 - full slices of Brisket - approx 1/4" - 3/8" thick cascade in the tray horizonal with the hinge.

We use "Joe Public" for judges - the Promoter might invite the town dignataries to be final judges.

Based on 30 teams -
We would run 2 pre-lim tables with 5 judges and they would judge 15 trays - the 7 - 8 highest scores would advance to the final table where we will have 7 - 9 different judges to judge those trays that have advance.

Your bbq needs to be good at room temperature because we do not go back and ask for additional meat.

I hope this might explain a little about the IBCA - you can check out our rules at www.ibcabbq.org

Thanks for asking the question.

[BAR "G" BBQ]

A lot of folks, myself included, don't quite get the differences between ICBS, LSBS, KCBS, MIM and the list goes on. So if someone who is a member of one or more of these groups could expound upon the virtues of their group(s) without disparging the remaining groups, I for one would be most grateful. How's that for a run-on sentence?

IBCA was started in to standardize the rules in the Texas area but we are spreading into other states. We use the double theater tickets on our turn-in boxes - one is taped to the top of the turn-in tray and the cook retains the other. NO ONE knows who the winning containers belong to until the tickets are matched. We also have the cook's sign the ticket that they retain so that there isn't any exchanging of tickets.

When the turn-in trays are issued the teams are give a piece of foil (potato wrap) to be laid flat in the tray - and are instructed to the exact amount of product to put into the trays plus the way it is placed in the tray.

1/2 chicken - fully jointed with a wing, breast, drumstick and thigh
7 - Pork SPARE Ribs individual with bone in placed horizonal with the hinge, meat side up all in the same direction. - NO BABY BACKS are allowed.
7 - full slices of Brisket - approx 1/4" - 3/8" thick cascade in the tray horizonal with the hinge.

We use "Joe Public" for judges - the Promoter might invite the town dignataries to be final judges.

Based on 30 teams -
We would run 2 pre-lim tables with 5 judges and they would judge 15 trays - the 7 - 8 highest scores would advance to the final table where we will have 7 - 9 different judges to judge those trays that have advance.

Your bbq needs to be good at room temperature because we do not go back and ask for additional meat.

I hope this might explain a little about the IBCA - you can check out our rules at www.ibcabbq.org

Thanks for asking the question.

Don't have any experience with KCBS or MIM other than reading the association rules ECT; although I hope to compete in some KCBS events in the near future.
LSBS is pretty much the same as IBCA with a few minor diffreneces. All are great associations with a common goal of promoting BBQ competitions while insuring the competitors a fair judging system.

[Burnt Food Dude]

KCBS has a program to certify judges. However, most contest go with about 50 to 60 % certified. Yes, they do allow celebrity or regular people judge. KCBS contests need 1 judge per team and 1 table captain for every 6 judges. At times, when there is a shortage of judges, a table captain can be judge.

As a competitor I do want as many certified judges as possible. Most of the judges are "on the same page" for judging. There are a few "maverick" judges that score however they feel and not according to KCBS criteria. In my limited experience as a cook and judge, it seems like once a certified judge judges 5 or 6 contests his scores don't vary that much from someone that has 15 or more contest under their belt.

Don't get me started on judging and complaints by teams about judges and visa versa.

[Burnt Food Dude]

I forgot to add the MBN is the Memphis Barbecue Network. It is the heir apparent to the MIM (Memphis in May) organization. I believe it was last year that the MIM organization decided that they would no longer sanction contests.

The MBN was organized to take over sanctioning and promote MIM type of contests. The MIM organization says they are going to concentrate on the MIM contest only.

I guess it takes a lot of manpower and work to throw a week long party.

Also from what I hear, I wasn't there, the MIM judging wasn't the greatest. I heard that there was a shortage of judges and some entries wasn't tasted for 30 to 45 minutes after turn in. I also heard (and I may be wrong) that MIM charges the judges to judge.

[DATsBBQ]

I really like the idea of double theater tickets. And I'm intrigued with charging the judges...after all, they eat for free wilst the rest of the folks got to pay

Guess categories are a regional thing. Chicken, if it's done low & slow usually results in skin thats akin to semi-tanned deer hides. Hence the grilling....but grilling by definition isn't low & slow.

Seldom see a whole hog roasted in these parts at comps or even parties. Maybe it goes to cost?

Then there is the bean thing. A traditional side to be sure, but seldom low and slow. Almost always there is a propane burner under those beans.

Ribs and brisket seem to be a favorite all most anywhere. Still got people that look crosseyed if I mention pulled pork, but not as many as there use to be.

I think that the more folks that are judging that are judging to a defined standard the better the contest would be. If you pulled 10 people off the street to judge here in Colorado, I bet 7 of em have never tasted BBQ outside of the ribs they sell in Safeway that are already cooked and sauced.

[Papa Tom]

Re: charging the judges, a good way to get someone to judge your comp. ONCE but if they walk off when full you're in trouble.

No problem finding experienced BBQ judges off the street here in Texas getting them to do it might be a different story. I think most organizations have a briefing and judging sheet to help standardize the judging process.

[bigwheel]

The only standarized judging criteria I ever heard expounded at IBCA LSBS contests is..dont count off as to whether it has a smoke ring or not..don't discuss the entrys with other folks at the table. Judge each entry on its own merits..not compared to another you have tasted. Other than that they mainly try to choose one which tastes good. You would be surprised at how much gets turned in which is inedible. I have heard estimates ranging from 50 to 75 percent..depending on the contest of course. Sure certain invitational and championship type events do much mo betta percentage wise. Usually folks fight over getting to judge brisket and ribs. It takes a brave person to judge the beans and chicken.

bigwheel

[Rub N Smoke]

I am a member of TGCBCA (Texas Gulf Coast Barbecue Cookers Assn.) We use basically the same rules as IBCA but we are ALOT smaller. When we have a meeting we are addressed by our names and actuallty have a good time, we're not just a number. Thats not saying we arent just as serious, as good or better than anyone else BUT we do seem to have more of a friendly apmosphere. Alot of us also cook for other sanctions such as the IBCA but at least for me I do mainly TGC. Cooks

[bigwheel]

Hey now if you think BBQ Mom dont know everybody's name you sadly mistaken. Even her old tall skinny ugly husband know everybodys name and that is a muracle cuz he got early signs of Alzheimers most likely. You may not realize it but you aint having any mo fun than anybody else. Now the folks I feel sorry for is the Hill Country bunch who have to cut up their spare ribs with some end nippers..limb loppers side cutters ets. Whut is up with that non sense? Drinking a toast to BBQ Mom..her ugly Hubby..and her mighty purty daughter named Laura as we speak. Glug glug glug.

bigwheel

I am a member of TGCBCA (Texas Gulf Coast Barbecue Cookers Assn.) We use basically the same rules as IBCA but we are ALOT smaller. When we have a meeting we are addressed by our names and actuallty have a good time, we're not just a number. Thats not saying we arent just as serious, as good or better than anyone else BUT we do seem to have more of a friendly apmosphere. Alot of us also cook for other sanctions such as the IBCA but at least for me I do mainly TGC. Cooks

[chilibbq]

thanks BW, couldn't have said it any better

[3 star redneck]

BTW Smoke, TGC was "IBCA" until about 2 years ago!! ...and that is the rest of the story.....